Dance Unscripted

Ep 10: The Transformative Power of Hope Stone with Jane Weiner

• Season 1 • Episode 10

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In this episode, Amy Elizabeth speaks with Jane Weiner, founder of Hope Stone, about the transformative power of arts education and emotional intelligence in empowering youth. They discuss the importance of instilling creativity and resilience in children, the challenges faced by communities, and the impact of project-based learning. Jane shares her insights on how arts education can combat mental health issues and foster a sense of belonging and self-worth among students. The conversation emphasizes the need for a holistic approach to education that integrates emotional intelligence and the arts to nurture well-rounded individuals.


Season One of Dance Unscripted is brought to you by a grant from the Lamar University Center for Resiliency.

Jane's Links:

Instagram- @hopestoneinc

Facebook- http://www.facebook.com/hope.stone

Website- www.hopestoneinc.org

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Amy Elizabeth:

Welcome to Dance Unscripted. I am your host, Amy Elizabeth. We're joined in the studio today by one of Texas's leading ladies of dance. Jane Wiener holds a degree in deaf elementary education and a minor in dance from Bowling Green State University. She spent over a decade in New York City dancing and touring with the Doug Elkins Dance Company before relocating to Houston in 1996. Jane founded Hope Stone Incorporated in 1997 with a vision to unlock the innate creativity of children and adults through the arts with two main projects, the modern dance company, Hopestone Dance, and the creative arts education outreach program, The Hope Project. In 2023, the organization shifted its focus to become a dedicated arts education nonprofit. On this episode, we'll be talking with Jane Weiner about her start, the shift, and her newest role as education director and leader of The Hope Project. Jane, thank you so much for joining us today. And

Jane Weiner:

thank you so much for inviting me, Amy. It's such a nice way to visit. We need to do it in person over coffee next time, though.

Amy Elizabeth:

Yes, absolutely. I agree. So I noticed that you begin your biography with the quote, you matter, we all matter. The magical power of the arts reinforces these words inside of us. What does this quote mean for you?

Jane Weiner:

So we've, you know, in the work that we're doing presently, I feel like, you know, it might be Hopestone 4.0. At this point, we just keep shifting. One of the biggest shifts we've had is in teaching creative emotional intelligence to our students. And the main goal, we primarily teach pre-K. And this year, we're very excited. We'll be adding eighth grade. We kind of have a track that we've been doing pre-K through fifth. And then we added sixth and seventh. seventh last year, and now we'll be doing eighth grade over at Marshall Middle School, which is one of the schools that we work in. And one of our main goals is that the children realize that they matter. And it was interesting. I was listening to, well, a podcast just the other day, and it talked about how we are all even. We're all equal. We're all even. And yet when you go to a conference the woman was saying, the first thing you do is you're like, so what do you do? And where are you from? And instead of being like, well, you matter, you're here. That's all that really matters. I mean, of course there's those talking points, but like, if we're all equal, if we're all even, if we all have equity, then we all matter. And our resumes and the things that, you know, I think we highlight and, oh, I did this and I did that. Like, even when you were reading my resume and when I sent you my bio, like those things don't matter. It's really just that you matter. You matter. You take space. You claim your seat, as we like to say. You belong here. All of us do.

Amy Elizabeth:

So why we're talking about our resume, we're talking about our identity, we're talking about these things, these accomplishments that we've had. But eighth graders at this point in their life don't have resumes. They don't have these touch points to fall back on. So why do you think that it's important for us to kind of instill this ideology into such young people?

Jane Weiner:

The mental health issues in this country are skyrocketing. Word just came out that the highest ISD, the highest public school with suicidal ideation and mental health issues is Houston ISD. Yeah, it's not good. It's not good. And we're also seeing the mental health numbers for our children go up. Thank you so much. And we need young, brilliant minds. I say this all the time to my students. You know, I am old. I can even feel my brain slowing down. And what I need is your fast and quick brains, you know, in all honesty, get off the phones, get off the computers and let's dive into some problem solving. And part of that is that they're not looking for likes or they're not looking for numbers on their Instagram or their TikToks. but that they know that they stand on their own two feet and that they matter. And that's true for all of us. I mean, I feel like we are losing our kindness and compassion at a rapid rate. That and icebergs are melting.

Amy Elizabeth:

So you mentioned emotional intelligence. So can you define creative emotional intelligence and kind of describe why you find this to be most important?

Jane Weiner:

Yeah. So when we teach our emotional intelligence classes, the first unit that we teach is what is EQ? What is emotional intelligence and what is it in response to IQ? And I'm going to quote, I kind of got this from Gayla Miller. She may have gotten it somewhere else, but Gayla Miller has been my teacher for many, many years, a great theater person and did a lot of backstage stuff. And now she's counseling and kind of creating her own work about emotional intelligence. And I'm lucky enough to consider her one of my dearest friends. And she teaches me as well. She's kind of like my guru, although I'm beginning to find many more. She's opened my world to like, you know, what do you do on a day off? I try to find more EQ podcasts to listen to or webinars because it's just fascinating how the brain works. But what we call EQ is the ability to be smart about feelings, our own and other people's. It involves being able to notice, to understand and act on emotions in an effective, kind and curious way. And with our heads in a phone, with nods, lot of project-based learning happening. I really see that in our school. There's a lot of kids with their headphones on and these little cardboard things around them, and they're not relating to one another. So I don't know if you're sad. I don't know if you're relaxed. I don't know if you're cheerful. All of these things, I'm not reading because I'm focused on something else. And therefore, as we say, read the room. I I don't think a lot of adults, middle schoolers, high schoolers, children know how to read the room because we are, I think, becoming electronically narcissistic.

Amy Elizabeth:

You use the term project-based learning. So can you give us an idea of what that looks like in the classroom?

Jane Weiner:

Yeah. So I'm thinking about that. So project-based learning, that's the arts, you know, when you really think about it. Like we had a fifth grade boys band. That's project-based learning. We had a fifth grade dance ensemble. That's project-based learning. We have an Odyssey of the Mind team. That's amazing project-based learning. We had a Bollywood class, project-based learning. Because if I don't know where you are in the room and you don't know where I am in the room, we're going to bump into each other. So project-based learning is just, there's so many things like emotional intelligence, project-based learning, like be Being able to have like that mood meter that we bring in for EQ, it's built right in. It's so organic. The arts basically are EQ mindfulness training for our kids. And then of course we meet the awareness part. We can't just say, oh, you're dancing, so you know EQ. But what we have to do is go back and say, this is why that worked kind of situation. We had a situation where we did a very big performance and we had a child have an emotional meltdown. She was emotionally, it was very hard. And the other dancers looked, they were compassionate in the moment, and then they pulled it together and performed. And I was like, they, you know, like they read it. They were like, she's not going to be able to perform with us. We have to go on the stage right now. So we're going to do that. And then when they were done, they came back and checked in on her. I mean, that just kind of wraps up everything that, you know, We want our kids to be learning, and they need to be learning on a daily basis. They really do.

Amy Elizabeth:

And so you're talking about being inside of the schools in this project-based learning. What are... You mentioned some of the programs that you have. How long do these programs last? So you say a performance. Is this a year-long project? Is this a semester project? Do the students change? Is it one select group of students?

Jane Weiner:

So the way it works is we do work at a preschool, and that's very much creative movement. And we try to do a lot of creative movement and movement-based, pretty much dance. We do do a eurythmics, which is music and dance together, pre-K through second. Because of the body-mind connection that dance brings. I remember listening to Anthony Brandt and he said, when a person listens to a piece of music and they put one of those skull caps with all the electronic buds on it, 88% of the brain lights up. So what is that number when we're listening to music and dancing? Now, Andy Noble may have done this. I need to kind of reach out to him because I know he puts electronic on everybody's brain all the time and makes everybody dance. But what is that percentage of the brain lighting up? If 88% does it with music going on, then what if I'm listening to the music, but I also have to bring my arm out on the eight or fold it on the one? So that development, that ability to regulate the body to do something across the floor, and these babies need it, especially our little ones that come from severe poverty, where a lot of times, a lot of the kind of like the basic learnings that, you know, I call it Mother East, sometimes that is missing. And so, you know, we'll see our kids sometimes come in having a lot of chunks missing or maybe not evaluated for ADHD or hearing loss or something like that. And so their regulation is, you know, non-existent in some cases, you know, running down the hallway, running outdoors, not being able to listen, overstimulated. And so bringing them into a dance class and asking them to move from point A to point B helps regulate. Can you sit? Can you move your arms on one? Can you follow directions? So we do that with our little ones. And then with the older ones, we do a second, third, fourth, and 5th at the schools that we work at, they get electives, video, photography, drumming, theater, singing club, modern dance, Bollywood, African dance, on and on. I can't even think of them all.

Amy Elizabeth:

No, that's an incredible lineup. And the students, they get to choose what they're interested in?

Jane Weiner:

We, for a third grader, actually third, fourth, and fifth this year, we'll have each have four electives that they'll choose. Wow. And then we do stay for the year because a Then kind of really trying to cater to our student. A lot of these children have abandonment issues. So I don't want to show up for, you know, a three week residency or three day residency or one week residency. I want to be there from September to May and we would be there. I mean, we're actually September to April is our early April. We kind of, we kind of bolt as soon as star testing happens. But we don't want to bolt this time. We want to stay around because we do know that we bring joy. We actually did a a whole evaluation and steadily watch the kids say that I matter and their joy go up over the course of the year. So we want to bring that because if a child's joyful, they're going to do a hell of a lot better on a test. They're going to show up to school. Their vagus nerve is going to be tonified and they're just going to be a healthier kid.

Amy Elizabeth:

Yeah. I mean, that was the first thought whenever you said start testing is I'm curious if there's evidence or data that shows that the students who are involved in this project have increased testing capabilities?

Jane Weiner:

So we did our own test with Rice University for COVID. So I'm also going to say that the pre-COVID and post-COVID child is a different child. And we are having to, all of us, I mean, those of us that have been teaching 30 plus years, our lesson plans are being changed. But we did have have a situation where it was kind of odd we were at Browning Elementary School and because of finances we could only do half the school which was terrible like some of the teachers were like why wasn't my class picked but we just didn't have enough money and we did it with I think that was there was no pre-k I think it was kinder through fifth and one class got it and one class didn't but for a study it was perfect and we did one we actually did it with Priscilla Rivas whose the principal at HSPDA now, but she was the vice principal there and doing her graduate work. So she helped us do this study. And we found out that like, first of all, the parents and the teachers saw that the regulation in the classes that Hoagstone was teaching was like something like 18% and 23% higher, 18% by the teachers, 20% by the teachers. 23% higher by the parents. If we keep calling art extracurricular, you know, when it is the complete circle and as the Greeks did it, you know, the sciences and the languages and the math and the arts were all one circle. And the minute you pull one out, you have an unbalanced child. And I think our children are unbalanced because they're not getting an even level of solid art.

Amy Elizabeth:

So I pulled this quote from the Hope Project. website. It's from one of the fourth grade teachers and they say, we invest our time and resources in these students because we believe this generation of children will help provide the solutions to their community's challenges. So can you discuss what these community challenges that the young people are experiencing, like what are they? And then kind of how does the art education empower them towards this change? Yeah.

Jane Weiner:

Oh, I go back and forth on that. I stay up at night thinking about it. So we moved from a Title I school into a very different Title I school, kind of unexpectedly. I think we're going into our seventh year at, sixth or seventh year at Clemente, and seventh or eighth year at Marshall. And that's all over in the near north side. When we talk about poverty, it's below poverty line. It's not poverty, it's below poverty line. And they did a study in, Clemente Martinez is balanced by two housing projects on either side. So 75% of our students come from these two housing projects, and then about 25% come in. And when they did one, one is significantly even more lower income than the other. And when they did the numbers there, they found that a lot of the numbers in the one project are something like 20 to 120% below poverty line. So that's a significant amount. So I don't even wanna say that they're one paycheck away from being homeless. They're less than one pay. Many of these families are less than one paycheck. Food scarcity is huge. One of the projects doesn't have 240 volt plugins. So a lot of times these families don't even have washer and dryer at their disposal. And with parents working, both parents working if there's both parents, sometimes it's just a lot of times it's a lot of single moms that live over there and they're working to get the laundry done is a huge fee. And then I'm also going to say, I just keep finding out more and more things we take for granted. What are some of the most expensive things? Laundry detergent. Laundry detergent is almost $20 for a big thing of it. And that's huge. And then if you've got laundry detergent, but you also need the gas to get to work. And then you need toothbrush and toothpaste, deodorant. And so these are the challenges that we're facing. And so it goes back to the I matter statement and grit and resilience. How do we say to these kids, we know you don't have the bootstraps. We're talking about pull yourself up by the bootstraps. And as you and I said earlier, there's no bootstraps to pull up. What they need to pull up is the you matter part. That's where it goes back to you matter and you are allowed to go beyond where you are right now. And I worry about that because for two reasons. First of all, there's poverty and then there's poverty of experience. So if a child doesn't even know there's more beyond and you think, oh, this city is is so big. There's so much to see. There's so many free things. It's not free things. I just want to shake people when I say free things means there's parking. It means you have to feed five children or three or one. It means the gas to get there and back. It probably means a lot of long lines. And it probably means that the only time you can go on Saturday is Saturday and Sunday. And you're exhausted because you've been working a million jobs. So like, you know, I keep hearing like, oh, there's so much free stuff. Somebody said that to me the other day. And I want to be like the amount of effort that goes in. I'm carpooling this summer for several kids because they've gotten scholarships for camps here and there. And their mothers can't do it because of their work schedule or a broken car or whatever, or they work, you know, like, I mean, all of that. And I'm carpooling and I'm thinking this is, you know, this is part of it. When you have, when you are... just hanging on by a thread. So it's hard. So going back to the question, it's the challenges of because they are in it and experience it. And if we can say you matter and with, I think the intelligence, the emotional intelligence classes and with what art brings, because art brings intuitively and organically, you matter when a child locks onto it. And it's hard. A lot of kids, everyone's like, Oh, we're giving them these free dance classes or these free music classes. Why aren't they more grateful? And I'm like, no, they can't be. Maybe they didn't eat. Maybe they didn't sleep. And maybe they got hit. Maybe something traumatic happened. And so for me to just be like, why aren't they grateful about what I'm offering is so white privilege. I mean, it just is. It's just privilege. I'm not even going to put a color in front of it. So the kids are in it. So if they can get it beyond. If I can look at this young generation and say, you're amazing. You're fantastic. You've got this over and over. So their little hippocampuses hear that over and over. And then they perform like when we've done our school performances and the kids come off and they're like, holy

Amy Elizabeth:

shit, I just did that. They don't

Jane Weiner:

say that because they would get in trouble. I'll say that for them. I just, I just jumped in front of a hundred people. you know, or, you know, whatever it is. We're Odyssey. Our Odyssey team has gone to States for four years, four years, like that. They come off the stage doing whatever they've done and they've completed it. That I matter is huge. And we need more of that. I need to pour more and more and more of that into the kids. And then they're going to be the ones that said, well, I lived there and I don't, I don't want little ones to live there anymore. That's what I hope. And their brains are so, I mean, the young brain is like, holy cow. It's just so malleable. Neuroplasticity is right there. So over and over, like we really want those pre-K kinders, we want them to know that they matter. First grade, you matter. By second grade, we are actually teaching kindness. It's too late in our school. We are teaching kindness to the kids.

Amy Elizabeth:

Yeah. Yeah. You know, there's a, I keep thinking of the devil's advocate here and this idea of you're saying that they may not have a toothbrush. They may not have laundry detergent. These are, you know, survival food, clothing, shelter. They may not have these things. So why are we focusing on, right? And again, playing devil's advocate here. Why would we focus on arts education over how to get them food, clothing, shelter?

Jane Weiner:

Yeah. Yeah. I ask myself that all the time. That's a really good question. But I feel like built right in is the organic kindness, compassion, curiosity, problem solving, critical thinking. And as their brains develop, and that's also why one, we're there all year, and two, we come back year after year. I'm not looking to expand the work that I'm doing. I'm actually trying to go deeper and wider. I'm trying to create a template that others might follow. You know, I always think of that, you know, I'm driving, you know, whenever I used to take long trips and I would see those like adopt a highway, you know, I want to kind of say to people, adopt a school, adopt a school, get in there. And we, I have been doing a lot, you We have volunteer librarians that show up two times a week to help the kids read, take out books, do sight words. There's so many things that these schools need. And I know we're up against some hard times because it is difficult with the current administration right now to volunteer the way it used to be. But I just keep saying, get involved in our young people. That to me is, that's like the acorn. You know, one When's the best time to plant a tree? 20 years ago. When's the second best time? Today. And I feel that way about our kids. They're the most important natural resource we have. And they, when they're 20 years from now, they're going to be dealing with the crap we have created. And we have better have creative critical thinkers. So yes, I know they come from all of that. And it's two-tiered. What I walked in, I walked in the first day at that school and I was like, here we are. We're the artists. We're here. We're going. Damn. And so it's two-tiered. It's very two-tiered. I mean, the story we tell, Hilary Schaaf was teaching a dance class and the kids were so hungry. So God bless my dear board member, Matt Harris, he brought cereal bars. So those cereal bars are like 120 calories a bar. So Hilary sat the kids down and she said, oh, and I have a surprise. Afterwards, we're going to get a cereal bar. And he said, I'm so excited. I'm so excited. And she said, well, you can eat it now. He said, oh, no, no, no, no. I'm going to split it in half and give it to my little sister when I go home. You know, this 120 calorie bar. And she said, don't you have anything to eat? He said, oh, no, we had crackers for dinner last night. So this is what we're dealing with. And so, yes, he was in that dance class and he got that love. And we also figured that out because we also know that the arts open us up and the kids begin to tell us. what their needs are. So it's, yes, you are a devil's advocate. We got to feed them. We got to bathe them. Sometimes the kids just cannot be in class and we can't force them. Don't you understand? My dance class is so important. No, this kid actually needs to throw themselves on the ground and roll and we're going to let you. And so we also have a lot of tactics for those babies.

Amy Elizabeth:

Well, it's also this idea of investment in the person and I can't remember. It was a podcast that I was listening to. And this idea, they were debating this idea of giving, for lack of better words, charity. And it was, well, you go and you give them the food, they're just going to ask for more. But if you teach them how to garden, then they will develop their own food and they will find their way out of this. And so it's this idea of teaching the skills to move forward and to move beyond. And that just kind of resonates a little bit with them being as young as they are and plant it. Like you said, plant that seed now, 20 years from now. What is that tree going to look like? What's the fruit coming from that tree? And what is the fruit from that tree going to feed others? And I think that's also important as the community is that by pouring into these young people, it gives them, encourages them that as they move through this, like that brother, he's going to take what he's given and he's going to pour it into his little sister.

Jane Weiner:

Yes. And that is the hope. And the other thing thing is and Gayla Miller helps me with this all the time we may not see the tree we may just see the acorn go in the ground and that is hard because you know like I was sharing that story before we started like you know there's so many kids that I work with and I see so you know like three steps forward seven steps back two steps forward nine steps back eleven steps forward four steps back I I mean, it is like that. And I know that it's that way with all people, but it's really, really hard because they have so much up against them. And I will sometimes say to myself today, if I love and connect, that's all that matters. If my lesson plan falls, if the kids are running around, if I love and connect, I've had a successful day because then they know they matter to me. Because sometimes... There was a point in my life where I didn't know I mattered. And people kept saying, I love you, Jane. I love you, Jane, till I could say, I love you, Jane. And that's where we are. Yeah.

Amy Elizabeth:

I mean, I'm 41 years old and having this, and I did not have the hardships that these young people had. I grew up a very privileged life, but even I hit 40 and this shift happened in my brain. And I just said, I mean, I don't know, this is like going on micro scale, but I looked at my partner last week and I said, I'm going to say something very arrogant. And he said, what's that? I said, I am cute. Thank you so much. place. So I can't imagine. how someone outside of my scope would feel. And I didn't ask for permission for this, but I'm going to do it anyway. My dad actually comes from hardship. And I was in my 30s before he actually started to talk about what his hardship was and about the people who cared for him and the cafeteria lady that would meet him at the end of the day at the back door and hand him food so that he would have food.

Jane Weiner:

Yeah.

Amy Elizabeth:

that evening and sitting in my home, having never gone without a meal in my life, staring at my dad in disbelief, like this could not have been the way for you. This could not have been your path. I don't understand this. How did you become this person? And I do believe that part of it is who he is. I think another part of it is his faith. And then I think it is the people who poured into him, the cafeteria lady, his foster parents, his That is what helped him get to that place. But sometimes it's unfathomable for me.

Jane Weiner:

Yeah, and I see that with our kids and I just keep thinking, I just wanna uplift you. I just wanna bring you in. I wanna tell you that you matter over and over and over again, that you're important to me. That's all I can do. I don't wanna be like, oh, you're important to the world because little kids can read through that. Even though we know they are, they don't feel that. It's more like it's got to be in their scope. Like you are important to me. You matter so much to me. And saying that over, yeah, it's been eye-opening. I like to say, you know, I saw some of your questions about, you know, like the dance company and all of that. And I loved choreographing. I love being creative like that. But this is the biggest dance I have ever choreographed in my life. To me, being in this community and we have kind of like, we're very local. We're in two elementary schools and one middle school. I mean, the ultimate dream would be to be in the four elementary schools and the middle school. We're not as interested in being in the high school. We would like to, but that's a lot. But if we could be in the four schools with an art and EQ program and then move into the middle school so that these kids have nine years of arts and emotional intelligence training, I feel like we could shift a community. And we could, then going back to your question, these kids have lived it. They know how to solve it. They're going to be like, it's kind of like if you've had a problem and you solve it on your own, if you've been there, it's like that experience, strength and hope. They've been there. They've had that experience. They got out of it. And this is what worked. Because there's times where I'm similar. My father, very similar story. And I never had a want. He took care of me because he pulled himself up by the non-existent bootstraps and got himself through. And really came from, you know, a lot of hardship like your father. And so I can't say to the kids, you know, we can do this because I didn't have to. Right. I see how they live. I pick these kids up. I see what they have and what they don't have. You know, all of that. And there's a part of me that's like, I don't know if I could. I don't know if I could pull myself through that. So what I need to just say is like, let me just Keep giving you the tools. Okay, here's the tool. Here's the pencil. Oh, you might throw it down. Here it is again. Oh, you might throw it down. And then trying not to judge or condemn them, their parents, their parents' parents, because that is the history books of that is not being written and is being taken out. I know that they don't want us to know about systemic poverty and why certain races are struggling because of what we did many, many years ago. I mean, it really, we have to look at that and I'm seeing it firsthand in the work. And so I have to teach these kids creativity because I want them to be creative because I think, again, going back to, we're not our resume, we're all equal. We're all even. We need equity. We need equity. And these kids, I love them so much. And I want them to have an equitable life, but they have to do it. I can give them the tools if I even have them, but it's up to them. It

Amy Elizabeth:

is. So in the season one, we are talking, and we mentioned this word earlier, we are really focusing on the idea of resilience and how dance education, arts education can help to empower resilience. So So my questions are, how have you witnessed resilience in this community that you're building? And what have you witnessed in the young people you work with and their ability to endure, to persevere? I

Jane Weiner:

had to really think on that because am I witnessing it?

Amy Elizabeth:

Yeah.

Jane Weiner:

I think The importance of art and social emotional learning is critical. So in the knowledge that in the emotional intelligence units that we do, we have one that's called parts of the brain and we teach parts of the emotional brain. That is what we are teaching. And I mean, basic rundown of prefrontal cortex, amygdala and hippocampus. We do a little bit about the corpus callosum and we do do a lot about the vagus nerve because I'm doing a ton of reading about low vagal nerve tonification, especially in children of poverty. Huge. Their tonification is awful. They don't sleep well. They don't eat well. There's not a lot of joy. And so the mind-body connection can be really harsh. So we're kind of looking at that and maybe sometimes non-existent. But what we teach to our kids over and over is really basic. Prefrontal cortex, I have a plan. Hippocampus, I remember that. Amygdala or watch out. And we teach them over and over that the amygdala likes to steal oxygen. It really likes to take that in. So what we're trying to do, again, in going to that I matter, is also I can regulate myself. That's one of the questions we ask them. One of them in our survey, we say, do you matter? Do all emotions, are all emotions equal? Which is yes, we want them to say yes, because it's okay to be mad. I just can't take it out on you. And also, can you regulate yourself? And the kids do this, this, or this. It's a very simple survey. And so what we are trying to teach them, again, in our incentives or in our evidence, our evidence-based, is if we can be in these schools, like imagine 10 years from now, we're in these four schools teaching the arts, which organically bring in SEL and all the things we talked about, and emotional intelligence, which brings out the knowledge that they're learning in classes in a very frontal way. The idea is our amygdala, when set off, steals all the oxygen. Well, our prefrontal cortex needs our oxygen. It's that basic. Like you can see it in the brain that if I get scared, I do this and it all goes to the amygdala. And the last thing I'm going to do is plan accordingly. You know, oh my God, there's a fire I don't know what to do kind of thing. So what we're trying to teach them is how to, okay, wait, let me just breathe here. What can I do to get back to here? So that's all true if it is a fire or I see a snake or something like that. But if it's an emotional reaction, that email that comes in, that TikTok that they see, that Instagram post, something along those lines, because that's what these kids are dealing with right now. that comes in and she said, she said something about me and the whole class knows about it. This is going to happen. Or I might have that memory. You know, I'm also learning that trauma in the hippocampus functions very differently. So say very, you know, kind of very hypothetical situation. When I was, you know, 16, I was jumped. And the way that holds in my brain is if somebody comes up behind me, it's not just like, I was joking around. I go into that. The trauma holds onto it. It goes into my amygdala. And then the first thing I want to do is run or... flight, fight, or whatever. Yeah. Freeze. Yeah. So freeze. Yeah. I was like, what's the third one? So we're trying to teach our kids how to utilize their brain in a art. I mean, we don't utilize our brains that way, Amy.

Amy Elizabeth:

I'm sitting here thinking about my own reactions because I tend to be quite reactive. I live in my emotions. I allow my emotions to flow through me and I become reactive to the point where it will take over my entire thought process and I will shut down and I will go inward and it can be quite disruptive and so I'm actually working now of how do I not allow that in and again I'm sitting here thinking mind blown I'm a grown person I'm in my 40s and I'm struggling with this and I can't imagine what that young person is trying to, to wrap their minds around. But then again, thinking if I would have had these tools at a young age, would I be grappling with this now?

Jane Weiner:

And that's what I said when Gayla kind of, you know, was teaching us this, I had the same kind of like aha experience of like, this needs to be, I mean, so there's a school that I do follow and the first five weeks of their school, this is all they teach. They do a five-week starter program on social emotional learning, emotional intelligence. And the basic is they have a mood meter. Here's red, blue, green, and yellow. And as simple as it is, if I know where I'm in, if I am yellow, but I'm yellow jittery, I'm not going to get anything done. So everyone's like, oh, you're so up, Jane. And I'm like, no, I'm actually I'm actually borderline anxiety, you know, or if I'm in that, you know, furious zone, am I going to take it out on, you know, God bless my dear husband, you know, is he going to get it? And so it's that, it's that ownership of like, all these emotions are important. I need to have that. But how do I manage them? And then the man, I mean, like at school, we have this superhero that lives inside of all of us called Captain Breath. And Captain Breath lives inside of us and tells us that 10 breaths or less will calm me down, move me from my amygdala or my trigger from the hippocampus that goes into my amygdala and makes it so that the next thing I'm going to do is hit Johnny next to me because I'm triggered or he took my pencil and you don't take my pencil kind of thing. Cause my dad told me I need to stick up for myself. No, no, no, no, wait, wait, wait, wait, you know? And then, so there's like all this language that we're using. Um, and it's, you know, and I, I would say to myself, where was I when I was in

Amy Elizabeth:

fifth grade? to be able to say what are my options now I can think clearly now I can have forward motion I can get through this and then with with the the power of the matter of I matter and that I'm important and I'm of value the encouragement that I am understanding that comes through that is then the young person is empowered to make a choice

Jane Weiner:

right

Amy Elizabeth:

that's going to help them to move forward in that space. It just... That's incredible. I'm learning so much. Yes.

Jane Weiner:

That's a brain dance. Like it has to kind of learn to go around. And then it goes from that me, we, them idea that we're trying to get the kids to do. So like we, you know, what we're trying to do is kind of over and over keep saying these same phrases, especially when they're young, because then it becomes like a jingle. Like we have a song like, who's in charge of my brain? I'm in charge of my brain. Like, so the kids, like I have kids. gardens they see me and i'm pavlov's dog and as soon as they see me they start to sing it or i have little ones that just start rubbing their hands together because that's the beginning of of dolphin bread so if they're thinking that way yay that's exactly what we want and it's it is you know i mean think about how we learn dance movement so it's that same kind of like chunking it together like it's the phrase of emotional intelligence that we're trying to do you

Amy Elizabeth:

This is a lot for me to take in. I'm going to be very honest. Like I'm learning so much about this and it's just, there's a certain aspect of it that's a little overwhelming, a little overwhelming because you don't know what you don't know. And so learning this information, learning where these students are coming from and kind of the differences. I work primarily in higher education now. I, when I was, when I was a young person in my, in my early twenties, I don't know. That's why I say that laughing. just looking at classroom management as a young 20-something year old and not even thinking about these young students as humans. And a lot of times we dismiss the young people, you know, well, they don't know yet. They don't know yet. And there's like almost a dismissal of them. And what I find really fascinating is incorporating these concepts at such a young age so that they will learn them and have them for lack of better words embedded in them by the time they get to the to the full brain capacity of being able to make these big life decisions exactly that impacts them and it just it makes me wish that i had this information sooner earlier But I can't go back. I can only go forward. So if I'm going to be working with young people moving forward, I think it's important that we start to acknowledge that they're not just tiny humans. They are a design of their own. Their brains work differently. Their bodies work differently. The way they see the world is different. And it's not because they don't know. They're going to know as they experience that. But there are things that we can start to, again, that we're in a bed. It's like programming.

Jane Weiner:

Yeah. And it is interesting. To me, it's like a commercial jingle. I think of jingles that I knew from years ago, double your pleasure, double your fun, with double mint, double mint, double mint gum. But it's that same idea that sometimes it's not even the concepts that they're learning. It's just the rote information that goes in. And then as the brain develops, because of course our prefrontal cortex doesn't fully develop till 25 for girls, 27 for boys. So with that going on, I do look back because now somebody who I'm 62 going back, because I'll look at the kids and go, will this matter? And then I think of all of the input that my parents did. And yes, it will. I know it will at different times. In all honesty, I hope that they live because some of them live in very harsh neighborhoods. I just want them to get out. But But again, to me, it's like, I'm fighting poverty of experience. I'm like, I can't fight poverty. I don't have any money. I can't give you all a million dollars and say, here's a house. But what I want to fight is poverty of experience. And that is by education. It is about knowing. It is about putting desire into kids. It is about letting them know that they matter. And then you're right. It's forward momentum. I can't look back right now. I've got to push you forward, forward, forward. It is like, and the other thing we know is every time we leap, we don't just sleep, we go and then we leap. So we have to take that breath. Captain

Amy Elizabeth:

breath. Captain breath. I'm going to take

Jane Weiner:

that. I have a gold cape and then I have this hat that next time I'm on, I'll bring it for you. I'll send a picture of a kid in it. Yes, please do. And the things go, if you squeeze, the ears go... So the kids love it. They do 10 breaths, you know, giggling the whole time. It's not the

Amy Elizabeth:

best breathing. But does it, laughter does, it forces us to inhale. It does, it forces us to breathe. Part of the

Jane Weiner:

nerve tonification is laughter and singing out loud, sing out loud every day.

Amy Elizabeth:

Okay. I got that one. Yeah. Sorry. So Jane, what would you like for our audience to know and understand about art at and emotional education. Like how can parents and educators incorporate more of this into their practices and their daily routines?

Jane Weiner:

Yeah, I really think in looking at, and this might be really bold statement, and I was a performance artist and COVID really changed me. COVID really changed. And I, you know, I came to the decision, it was time for me to close the company and I loved performing and I loved choreography, but it really changed me. I think sometimes people see that performative is here and the education of the performance is below. That it's a below thing. And in being in the schools and watching our frontline teachers work, I feel like performance is beautiful. It's amazing. I love to go to great symphonies. I love to go see great dance companies and plays and all of that. Performance and art is all around. But the highest part of our form is the teaching of it. It is bringing it to our next generation. And of course, as we're up against all this NEA cuts and everything like that, we are the storytellers. And it's not just telling it on stage. Sometimes it may be to three children. It might be to a class of 12 kindergartners. And that is as important as these high, high, high level performances. And as somebody that I I lived to win a Bessie. I lived to be a performer. I lived for all of that. And that has shifted in me. Now, maybe it's because I can't do it anymore, but really it is. I feel like it is such a higher calling to go in and to boost. I mean, the power of arts education is extreme. It is like this golden ball. That's like this. I always think of that kidditch or whatever in Harry Potter. It's like that thing that goes like that. It can go all over and it just lights up. And when a child, and a lot of times kids think art is easy. Art should be fun, but art is not easy. And when that kid all of a sudden understands it, like swallows it and that gold comes out of them, I don't think there's any way that they can turn themselves off. I feel like they can just go and go and go. Of course, we need to support them with it. So I think what I want our audiences to know is, how important social emotional learning is. It is key. I feel like it trumps math and reading. Well, maybe not reading, but it's equal. It's equal to all of them. It cannot be displaced, nor can the arts. They have to be in our school if we are going to have whole children.

Amy Elizabeth:

Yeah. We've been talking about the whole person paradigm.

Jane Weiner:

Right. And if you can't teach, support it. Yes. Because not everybody's a teacher, but make sure our teachers are being supported, vote for people who give teachers raises, and vote for people who put arts with our kids.

Amy Elizabeth:

Absolutely. Jane, thank you so much for bringing your mission and vision for youth education and the importance of art education to our audience. I have a feeling that they will be shifted and changed because I know that I am. And like I said, I've learned so much from this conversation. And now I'm just thinking of what can I do? What's my forward motion now? Because when you know better, you do better. So now that I have this information, what is my forward motion? What are the choices that I can make now? What are the possibilities now that I have this information? So thank you so much for bringing it to us. And we do end each one of our episodes with our rapid round. And this is kind of our thread line for season one. So I'm going to ask that as quickly as you can, but no rush, you can finish these two sentences. Number one is resilience is. Important,

Jane Weiner:

amazing, and sometimes we have to dig very deep to find it.

Amy Elizabeth:

Yeah. And dance has taught me.

Jane Weiner:

Dance has taught me the power and the equity for all that we all have. The power of it and that it makes us all equal. And we should all, all, all, all be dancing on a regular basis. And myself included, I'm trying to get back to flamenco.

Amy Elizabeth:

And what that means. And I think not to start going off on another tangent, but this idea of one of our missions here is to help people define what dance is for them. Because for some of us, it means a professional career. For some of us, it does not. But in order for art to be for all of us, we have to erase some of those ideas. ideologies of what dance is and this idea of two left feet or whatever excuse that we give ourselves. And I like to say that if you're a moving, breathing being, you are a dancer. Yep. Yep.

Jane Weiner:

And also the knowledge that 72% less chance of Alzheimer's dementia if you dance on a Dance heels.

Amy Elizabeth:

Yeah. Dance heels. It's empowering.

Jane Weiner:

Yeah.

Amy Elizabeth:

Jane, thank you again for bringing all this knowledge and information to us. Saying thank you is not enough for me in this moment, but thank you.

Jane Weiner:

Well, thanks for having me. And we need that real cup of coffee soon. Okay.

Amy Elizabeth:

Yes, absolutely. Okay, I believe... Yep. I believe that we are... Nope, it's still saying it's recording.

Jane Weiner:

Yeah, it looks like it's still recording.

Amy Elizabeth:

Something went wrong. I'm not refreshing the page because it told me to do that before and I didn't do it. Okay.

Jane Weiner:

It looks like it's uploading, though, for you.

Amy Elizabeth:

Yeah. Everyone...

Jane Weiner:

We can say goodbye and record it and we can like cry and be really dramatic at the end.

Amy Elizabeth:

Well, actually, I'm being serious. I like cry because I, yeah, yes. I mean, it's just, I'm feeling quite emotional right now. It's,

Jane Weiner:

it's, it's big work. And you know, like when I, I mean, I keep saying that over and over, but it's the biggest thing I've ever done in my life. And I went out to coffee with a friend yesterday and, you know, it has gone further than Hopestone. I mean, we do our arts education classes and we do the emotional intelligence, but you know, I help with the library. We have a resource room because wraparound was canceled. We I helped with the fifth grade dinner dance. That was really fun. We do literacy night. They're helping. They're asking, you know, we have a garden now. We have a soccer team, like all of the things. And I just realized, you know, at this point in my life and I have no children and I have no grandchildren, although I have kind of like pseudo adopted a family, this really is my calling. And I'm so happy to be able to give because, you know, my friend Emily said, do you think you're spreading yourself too thin? And I said, yep. And I'm very aware of that. And It's what I want to do. It's actually my choice to do it.

Amy Elizabeth:

Yeah.

Jane Weiner:

So,

Amy Elizabeth:

you know. It's really incredible. I'll get you to come to the

Jane Weiner:

school. I'll get you to come to the school one day. I think, you know, you would really love meeting the kids. They're unbelievably special. Everybody that walks in that school goes, wow, you know, this is a hard school and there's something about being here. And that's just one of, you know, we were in several, but that's the one that really is like our flagship. So anyway, yeah.

Amy Elizabeth:

Okay. Thank you. I'm going to need to process all of this now, but thank you so much for giving me your time twice. Oh, that's okay. And making this happen. I'm

Jane Weiner:

glad we got this one to work because I think it's just so much easier for you too.

Amy Elizabeth:

It is. And I mean, I am perfectly okay that we did not talk about your choreographic career, even though I'm still inspired by it. We're going to bring it back. We're going to wrap around. We'll do it again soon, but. Yeah, this was important. This is exactly what it needed to be. So thank you very much. You got it. Okay. Have a blessed evening. Okay. You too. All right. Take care.

Jane Weiner:

Bye-bye.

Amy Elizabeth:

Thank you for joining us for this emotionally inspiring conversation. It took an unexpected turn as we bypass Jane's incredible performance and choreographic career and dive deep into her vision to unlock the innate creativity of children through arts education. You can find Jane and information about the Hope Project at hopestoneinc.org and direct links can be found in the show notes. Be sure to click subscribe and share with a friend or colleague and leave us a review on Spotify for a chance to win Dance Unscripted merch. We know you could have chosen any platform and you chose us and you chose dance. And for that, we are incredibly grateful. A special thank you to the Lamar University Center for Resiliency for making this season possible.